How The Zombies Went from English Teen Rockers to Hall of Famers

The Zombies were core to the British Invasion of the 1960s, with songs like She's Not There, and Time of the Season. "Hung Up On A Dream: The Zombies Documentary" explores how the English teenagers became Rock and Roll Hall of Famers. Lead singer Colin Blunstone discusses the group's story, and takes listener calls, along with the film's director Robert Schwartzman. On Wednesday evening at Gramercy Theatre, there will be a screening of the film followed by Q&A and unplugged performance with Blunstone and Schwartzman's band, Rooney.

Alison Stewart: This is All Of It from WNYC. I'm Alison Stewart. Before The Zombies were Rock & Roll Hall of Famers, before they were hit makers of the British Invasion, they were a ragtag group of teenagers from St. Albans in England. Briefly, the band went by a name called The Sundowner. That didn't last too much longer. It would take only a few more years before The Zombies got their big hit with She's Not There.

[MUSIC - The Zombies: She's Not There]

Well, no one told me about her, the way she lied

Well, no one told me about her, how many people cried

But it's too late to say you're sorry

How would I know, why should I care?

Please don't bother trying to find her

She's not there

Well, let me tell you 'bout the way she looked

The way she'd act and the color of her hair

Her voice was soft and cool

Her eyes were clear and bright

But she's not there

Alison Stewart: More would follow, like Time of the Season from the album Odessey and Oracle, which Rolling Stone ranks among the greatest albums of all time. The stories of The Zombies is told in the documentary Hung Up on a Dream, directed by Robert Schwartzman, who is also a musician. Tonight at Gramercy Theatre, there will be a screening of the film, plus an acoustic performance by Blunstone and Schwartzman's band, Rooney. First, they join me in studio. Colin, it is very nice to meet you.

Colin Blunstone: It's very nice to meet you, too.

Alison Stewart: It's so nice to meet you, Robert, as well.

Robert Schwartzman: Thank you. Appreciate that.

Alison Stewart: Listeners, we're taking your calls. Are you a Zombies fan? Did you grow up with them in the '60s? Did you discover them more recently? Call in and share your memories, your favorite song, or maybe you have a question for lead singer, Colin Blunstone? 212-433-9692, 212-433-WNYC. You can join us on air, or you can text to us at that number as well. When did you become a Zombies fan?

Robert Schwartzman: If I could close my eyes and really remember exactly the moment, I wish I could, because that comes up a lot when we talk about the Hung Up on a Dream documentary. I discovered the band in my early childhood, really. I grew up in Los Angeles, a great city for music. It's lucky to just drive down the street and you see a lot of great music venues around you. A lot of cities don't have such great venues. I grew up in a family of musicians. I grew up in a family that listened to a lot of music, and I was exposed to a lot of wonderful songs, like songwriters. I would say oldies but goodies radio station was what I listened to all the time as a kid.

New York, Brill Building, girl groups in the '60s. British Invasion music. Obviously, The Zombies were such a huge part of the British Invasion. If you're listening to British Invasion music, if you can't name The Zombies as one of your favorites, then you don't know what you're talking about. Obviously, the music that Colin has been a part of is such an inspiration to me, and it inspired me to want to make a movie.

Alison Stewart: Colin, when and how did the idea of The Zombies documentary start?

Colin Blunstone: I think really, it was a conversation between Robert and our management company, The Rocks, who are in New York. We weren't really part of that conversation until Robert phoned myself and the other former original member, Rod Argent, and we talked on a Zoom, actually. We were in London, and Robert was in LA, but it was just very obvious. Robert, first of all, comes from a filmmaking background, but also, he's a very accomplished musician as well. I think it was a marriage made in heaven. We could just feel the empathy from Robert about the band and the subject of our lives.

There was never any question that we would not want to work with Robert. He's very, very good as a film director, but also, he understands a musician's mind and how the music business works.

Alison Stewart: What questions as a documentarian did you want to get answered with your documentary?

Robert Schwartzman: I'll say, we made this movie independently. It's important to say that because some movies get made through big companies that just want to pay for some big movie to get made. Independently would be like you're driven by your heartbeat is the pulse that moves along the project through the process of making independent. Any movie, narrative or documentary, takes a lot of heart and a lot of passion to get it going. I just wanting to make my first documentary. I've directed feature narrative, scripted films, but I wanted my first doc to be about something that I really loved so much.

For me, you know, to tell a story about a band you really, really love so much, wanting their story to be told on screen, to leave behind for a lot of generations to come, their story to be an inspiration to other musicians because we know the music. She's Not There just played. We know that. What a great song. Everyone in the radio station was dancing just now. Timeless. Time of the Season. It'll always leave that feeling for us, but let's dig deeper, right? I think that's the beauty of a documentary, is being able to get in closer to the subject. I wanted to learn as an objective viewer on the outside. I really made this movie as an audience member wanting to learn as I went.

I know some of the key highlights in this story, but I learned so much just getting to talk to Colin and Rod. On screen, you really can't take your eyes off them. Colin, you're sitting here looking at-- [laughter] It's true, man. It's true. No, but there's something-- We did the first interviews actually in New York. We're in New York and we were here together. We started this movie in New York. To me, I wanted to just be a fly on the wall and just take in their story and then find our way through the edit to really figure out how we're going to tell this 60-plus years of history in 90 minutes. That's how you make a movie.

Alison Stewart: Colin, can you think about or pinpoint the moment when you knew that the band was going to have legs?

Colin Blunstone: In a way, I can. We were an amateur band of very of 15-year-old boys. I didn't dare to think of us ever being a professional band, let alone having hit records. That thought never crossed my mind. I just love to play rock and roll music, but we won a really big competition. It took us completely by surprise. There's probably a hundred other bands, and we won. It led to a contract with Decca Records. Although we never talked about it, for the first time, I thought maybe, just maybe, there's a way ahead. That was the moment for me, when we won this rock and roll competition in 1964. It's a long time ago.

Alison Stewart: Were you thinking about who the audience for The Zombies was going to be?

Colin Blunstone: Oh, no. I didn't think as deeply as that. I was having a problem thinking about what was happening tomorrow, let alone the audience. No, no, it's much more amateurish than that. There were so many wonderful surprises. I found that two of the guys in the band were really wonderful songwriters after that competition. I had no idea. One of them wrote that song that you just played, She's Not There. I was amazed when he turned up having written that song very quickly with no fanfare. He just said, "I've written a song." That was our first song. It was number one in America. It was a million seller.

So many things happened so quickly just over a few months. We went from being skinny teenagers playing local gigs around where we come from, north of London, to coming to New York and playing the Murray the K Show, the Christmas show in 1964 with Dionne Warwick and The Shangri-Las, The Shirelles, Chuck Jackson, Benny King. These were our gods. How on earth did we end up there? It was wonderful. We were young, and we just went with it.

Alison Stewart: Got a text here that says, "I just got in the car and She's Not There was on. I just started singing happily even before I realized I had on WNYC. Who's not a Zombies fan?" This one says, "Seeing the Zombies perform Odessey and Oracle live for its 50th anniversary was something I never imagined I'd be lucky enough to experience. It was truly transcendent. Thank you so much for the beautiful art throughout your career, Colin."

Colin Blunstone: Thank you.

Alison Stewart: Let's talk to Stefan from Armonk. Hi, Stefan, are you there?

Stephen: Hello?

Alison Stewart: You're on the air.

Stephen: Oh, it's Stephen.

Alison Stewart: Stephen.

Stephen: It's Stephen. It's okay. Guys, you have no idea. You're in the studio with a real gem, okay? That's number one. I wanted to make sure I do a little promoting there. Anyway, this is why people are sustaining members to WNYC because they get to talk to people like Colin Blunstone and the person that made this documentary. I don't know where to begin, except to say that The Zombies, you guys did have commercial success, but at the time, it was flying under the radar compared to some of the other bands. It's just true. When I play, I always felt that Paul Atkinson was an incredibly underrated instrumentalist.

Alison Stewart: Yes.

Colin Blunstone: Yes.

Alison Stewart: You know what, I'm going to dive in, Stephen. Thank you so much for calling. We appreciate it. One thing I got from your documentary, Robert, was that these gentlemen are friends.

Robert Schwartzman: That's right.

Alison Stewart: I've seen a lot of rock docs. You don't end up with that feeling at the end that they truly are friends.

Robert Schwartzman: No question. That's a big theme in the film. Friendship, hope, weathering the storm, as they say. There is a beauty, and it's rare to have a band for so long playing music or known as a band for so long to come out the other side of the business, maintaining that brotherhood and connection, that innocence that originally got them together. I think it's a really emotional part of the film.

For me, as a filmmaker, Hung Up on a Dream really shows you that there are relatable things, that even today, musicians today, young musicians, I think should see Hung Up on a Dream, just because really, you can relate to the things the band went through even back in the '60s, up until now. It's so relatable, and it makes you feel not alone, like someone gets you. It shows you what artists do go through and what it means, I think, to follow your heart and come from a place of purity in your music, because it really is--

Every time I watch the movie again and again with the audiences, my biggest takeaway is just that these guys love music so much. It's such a natural thing for them. Some artists get into music to chase the career, or the money, or the fame. Even in film. Some people want to be an actor because they want-- There are those that ust chase it because they absolutely love it. Whether they have whatever level of success you have, they absolutely love it, and they're never going to stop doing it. I think, in this film, that's another takeaway. I think music is the glue that keeps this friendship intact. They're just very respectful of each other.

There are bands that have mega, crazy success, and they can't even look at each other or be in the same room.

Alison Stewart: Yes, it's true.

Robert Schwartzman: It's like, what version do we want, I guess, in anyone's lives? Do you want to maintain the friendship, or do you want to just chase whatever version of mega duped, crazy success is? Anyway, I'm so happy you said that because I think Hung Up on a Dream: The Zombies Documentary is more than just a movie about a band. I think it's a movie, really, that gives us a feeling of hope and energizes us. It's uplifting.

Alison Stewart: This text says, "I traveled two hours upstate to see Colin and Robert in Saugerties a few weeks ago.

Robert Schwartzman: Oh, yes.

Colin Blunstone: Right, yes.

Robert Schwartzman: Thank you.

Alison Stewart: "This doc is a must-see for any music fan, especially those who grew up with the British Invasion."

Colin Blunstone: Brilliant.

Robert Schwartzman: Nice.

Colin Blunstone: Brilliant.

Alison Stewart: We'll have more after a quick break. This is All Of It.

[MUSIC]

Alison Stewart: You are listening to All Of It on WNYC. I'm Alison Stewart. I'm speaking with Colin Blunstone, lead singer of The Zombies, along with Robert Schwartzman, director of Hung Up on a Dream: The Zombies Documentary. There's a screening of the film tonight at Gramercy Theater with a Q&A and acoustic performance to follow. Zombie fans, we're taking your calls. 212-433-WNYC, 212-433-9692. If you have a question, we would love to hear it. Let's talk to Kat from Manhattan. Hi, Kat. Thanks for making the time to call All Of It.

Kat: Thank you, Alison. Thank you for having these wonderful gentlemen on. I'm a huge Zombies fan. I have a quick question for Colin. I know this beautiful, uplifting film was quite an emotional roller coaster for him. I was wondering if this led him to look up people from his past or revisit his past somehow, maybe write a song about his past.

Colin Blunstone: Yes, I think it does. It does invigorate you when you see your life flashing past you in 90 minutes. It's a very emotional thing. I think it has stimulated me to write songs and to make contact with old friends. The other thing I've thought of is there had been two or three publishers have asked me to write my biography. I was literally saying just before I came in to do the interview, "If I'm going to do a biography, now is the time." Kat, an answer to your story, I think one of the main things I've taken away from the documentary is that if I'm going to write an autobiography, I'd like to try making an autobiography if I can, now is the time. Thank you so much for your question.

Alison Stewart: One of the stories you tell us in the film, it's so amazing because when you were young, you were very popular in the Philippines.

Colin Blunstone: Yes.

Alison Stewart: You go over to the Philippines, and you have this residency and this sold-out show. Ultimately, I hope I'm not speaking out of turn, but you get ripped off.

Colin Blunstone: I think that's taking it lightly. I had a vision, I think I said it in the film, that we were going to play probably in a hotel bar. I thought it would be great. In the day, we can do some swimming and exploring, and we would just play in a hotel bar. From memory, I know Chris White said we got £100 a night between us, but I know that's not quite right. We got £80 a night between us, which is probably $90 or something between us. I remember we have to pay 20% commission to a manager and 10% to an agent. We were getting less than 10 pounds a night each, and we opened to 28,000 people.

We had no idea that we were that successful in the Philippines. There was no Internet, so there's no way of knowing that we had five records in the top 10 when we got there. It was the most staggering experience. We opened to 28,000 people, and then the next night, we played to 32,000 people. It went on like that for 10 days. We were earning 80 pounds a night. This is not a good feeling, but the shows were fun. I mean, that side of it. I must emphasize that all bands in that era went through the same thing. It's not just us. It's not a cry for sympathy. I think it's mildly amusing, to be absolutely honest. I think it's really funny that we should be paid 80 quid to play to 28,000 people.

Alison Stewart: What did you learn, though, about the business?

Colin Blunstone: It's a general learning experience, isn't it? In that respect, I guess you have to try and do as much research as you can about where you're going. It works in lots of different ways. Certainly, financially, but it always intrigues me that from territory to territory, you may have hits in this country that they won't know in this country at all, so you have to do a bit of research. Which songs do people know? You don't have to just play hits, but you should play the hits you have in that country.

Alison Stewart: Let's take another call. Alan from New Canaan, Connecticut. Hi, Alan.

Alan: Hi. Thanks for taking me. I was 15 years old, started collecting records, singles at that time. Walked down to my local record store in Queens, New York, and bought She's Not There. First record I ever bought among hundreds of them that followed.

Colin Blunstone: Oh, really?

Alan: The second record I bought was You Really Got Me by The Kinks. I always saw that kind of competition between those two bands. The difference is that the Kinks kept on being played in New York. The Zombies, after Tell Her No, they were not played. I even went on and bought more singles like She's Coming Home. I think I may be the only person who ever heard the third single in New York at that time, and was very happy when, in '68, you came out with your final album and Time of the Season and all of that. I wonder why did you lose either popularity or the station is not playing you? Second question, you guys have recombined over the years and played together under The Zombies. Are you still doing that?

Colin Blunstone: In the first place, why did it slip away? I don't think we were managed very well. We had a very short-sighted manager that thought that we would have a very short career and he just wanted to make the most financially that he could. I think we were also hampered by the fact that we had two wonderful writers in the band, but they were just starting their careers, so when She's Not There hit, they didn't have a back catalog of songs. They were learning their craft in the full glare of the public. By the time we got to Odessey and Oracle and Time of the Season, they were well-rounded writers.

The question is always, what would have happened if we'd kept going? I think that would have been very interesting. I've forgotten what the second part of the question is.

Alison Stewart: He wants to know if you were touring.

Colin Blunstone: Oh, of course, yes. I got together with Rod Argent in 1999. I had a keyboard player who kept not turning up for various reasons, and I thought I was going to have a heart attack if I went on working with him, so out of the blue, I phoned Rod Argent who I hadn't worked with regularly since the '60s. He said, "Yes, I'll do the last six gigs on the tour." Then he enjoyed it so much, we kept going for 20 years. Sadly, that has now come to an end. Unfortunately, Rod had a stroke last summer, so The Zombies won't play anymore now, but we had a wonderful 20 years that we weren't expecting, from 1999 until 2024.

It was fantastic. We built the band right up again, and we were playing major venues. Although you might not have seen us in the charts, we were there, believe me, and we were playing major venues.

Alison Stewart: Robert, we should point out. There were fake Zombies.

Robert Schwartzman: Yes, there were fake. I know. In the movie, Hung Up on a Dream, we explore a little bit of the fake Zombies storyline. Again, there's so much history there, it's hard to jam it into 90 minutes. You need a TV series about it. Actually, it's interesting what this caller's question too about playing still. I always find it interesting too, because even-- I started a band called Rooney when I was in high school. We were signed out of high school. A lot of similar storylines for my band and the Zombies with having radio singles and touring, but you meet fans who really love the band, but they don't realize you're still playing.

We live in a world today where people are pretty connected. I'm just telling everyone listening right now. If there's any bands out there you love from any era, go on social media and try to follow them so you know what they're doing, because I promise you, they're posting on Instagram or something about where they're going to be doing something. Rooney opened for The Zombies while we were shooting Hung Up on a Dream: The Movie. I got to shoot and tour together, but I'm just saying, I just think there's-- We did a tour together. All of the Zombies, we're playing a show tonight at Gramercy Theater. If you're in New Canaan, you got an hour and 10 minute drive.

Alison Stewart: They're here. [laughs]

Robert Schwartzman: You can come to see a live Zombie set tonight of our unplugged show.

Alison Stewart: Really quick. Let's talk to Mark in Clifton. Mark, you've got about 30 seconds.

Mark: Thank you very much. Huge Zombies fans since whenever. Wanted to ask Colin to talk a little bit about his solo career. I've got an old vinyl of the Say You Don't Mind album. Beautiful song, beautiful album. You've had a lot of success solo in Britain over the decades, but unfortunately, it doesn't seem like you had the solo success in the US that I think you deserve for your beautiful and distinctive voice.

Colin Blunstone: That is true. It goes back to what I was saying earlier on where you have to make sure, whichever territory you go to, you're familiar with the songs that were hits, because it's always intrigued me. For instance, The Zombies probably had bigger hits in America than they did in the UK, but my solo career was the other way around. I had bigger hits in the UK and in Europe, and I didn't have any hits in the States, I'm afraid. Who knows why? Why does this happen?

Robert Schwartzman: I kind of know why.

Colin Blunstone: Oh, Robert, but it's too late.

Robert Schwartzman: No, I don't want to take up our time. All I want to quickly say is because sometimes, when you have a record label based in a certain territory, they tend to work you in the market that they're located in. Not all artists, even if you're assigned to a label across many territories, you still get a lot of focus in, let's say, the UK versus the US. Maybe there wasn't a US-based label working it. There are ways music reaches audiences. It's not a mystery. It takes people to push and work it. Maybe that's why.

Colin Blunstone: Oh, right. Of course.

Alison Stewart: I also need to look up Neil MacArthur.

Robert Schwartzman: Oh, yes.

Colin Blunstone: Absolutely.

Robert Schwartzman: Let's save it for the movie. Hung Up on a Dream, everybody.

Alison Stewart: All right.

Robert Schwartzman: A lot of stories.

Alison Stewart: All right. Neil MacArthur. Remember that, everybody. The name of the film is Hung Up on a Dream. In studio, I've been speaking with Colin Blunstone, lead singer of The Zombies, and along with Robert Schwartzman, they'll be at Gramercy Theater tonight for a Q&A and an acoustic performance to boot. Thank you so much for being in the studio and taking our calls.

Colin Blunstone: Thank you. Thank you so much.

Robert Schwartzman: Thank you, everyone. Thanks for having us.

Alison Stewart: I think we should go out on Time of the Season.

Robert Schwartzman: Why not?

Colin Blunstone: Okay.

Robert Schwartzman: Why not?

Alison Stewart: Why not?

Robert Schwartzman: A little dance. [crosstalk] Let's see if you know this one.

[MUSIC - The Zombies: Time of the Season]

It's the time of the season

When love runs high--