2000 Meters to Adriivka' Spotlights the Soldier Experience in Ukraine

Pulitzer Prize and Oscar-winning director and journalist Mstyslav Chernov joins to discuss his new documentary, "2000 Meters to Adriivka." The film follows an assault brigade of Ukrainian soldiers fighting to take back control of the small village of Adriivka. "2000 Meters to Adriivka" is in theaters today, and will premiere on PBS later this year.

*This episode is guest-hosted by Tiffany Hanssen.

Tiffany Hanssen: Last year, the documentary film 20 Days to Mariupol took home the Academy Award for best documentary feature. The film captured the earliest days of Russia's invasion of Ukraine. Now, for his second documentary, director Mstyslav Chernov, embedded with the soldiers on the front lines of Ukraine's 2023 counteroffensive attacks. The film is titled 2000 Meters to Andriivka, and it mostly uses body camera footage to give viewers the sense of danger and horror faced by this group of soldiers. They're fighting in a tiny forest to take back control of Andriivka, a strategically located village which has already been completely reduced to rubble. Viewers see the soldiers fight to move forward meter by meter, some advancing while others are wounded or killed. 2000 Meters to Andriivka will be released in New York theaters today. It will premiere on PBS later this year. We are joined now by Mstyslav Chernov. Welcome.

Mstyslav Chernov: Hello. Thank you for invitation. What a day.

Tiffany Hanssen: What a day. I'd like you to take us back just 2023. Situate us in time and space. Where is Andriivka? What's happening at that time?

Mstyslav Chernov: That's a tough time for Ukraine. Tough time for me too. It was summer of the counter offensive that it was highly expected and anticipated. Ukrainian army started advancing on all the fronts, but Russian army was digging in for quite a while at that point. The counteroffensive was going quite slow and with a lot of casualties. At the same time, I was traveling in US and in Europe with 20 Days to Mariupol, premiering it in cinemas, visiting the red carpets, and right after that, get in the plane, get in the car, get in the train, getting on the front line.

I was traveling between these two worlds, seemingly incompatible, because it felt like a journey a hundred years back in time or another planet. All the destroyed cities, all the mutilated land. It's also very personal for me to see those cities in that land. It's two hours drive from my hometown, Kharkiv. I was going to Ukraine, and I joined this platoon on their mission. The mission was, at the same time, simple and clear, cinematic almost, because when you have your protagonists, you have a very, very clear goal, and then they just need to do it. At the the same time, it was so painful and so symbolic at the same time.

Tiffany Hanssen: Andriivka, I mentioned in my introduction, Andriivka at this point had already been destroyed. Tell us about why this village was so strategically important, and what the condition was there at the time.

Mstyslav Chernov: It is a bit of a spoiler. It is a discovery that would make an end of the film, but it's fine.

Tiffany Hanssen: You could tap dance around this.

Mstyslav Chernov: The film is much-- it's deeper than that, but it is one of the discoveries that we make in the end of the film. After the fight, it takes the brigade nearly three months to get through this one mile of a narrow forest squeezed between two minefields. It is a very heavy and a very slow battle. Something you could run in 10 minutes, you spend three times to cross. Of course, when you reach that village, when you see that it's destroyed, and when you still see them raising the flag, you see them doing what they intended to do. You understand that it's not only about a liberation of land and fighting for the survival of the country, it's also about symbol of hope. That flag they raise over the village is a symbol of hope.

Tiffany Hanssen: How much of this-- You mentioned this is a very narrow, sort of a short distance, relatively speaking. It seems like it's all very self-contained to a small area. How much of this story about what happens in this very small area is a microcosm of what's being played out?

Mstyslav Chernov: Exactly. I think that that forest, for me, was always a symbol of the entire war, of the Ukrainian effort to liberate the land we all call home. That's what gets me in this story, the ability of just zoom in and just be there without distractions to focus on that small strip of land, on that small platoon, that is, walking through it.

Tiffany Hanssen: By a small platoon, we're talking how many people?

Mstyslav Chernov: We're talking 100 people. The brigade is obviously bigger and there is a bigger effort happening all across the front line, but we ourselves focus on a small group of soldiers. I think it's just-- with so much noise that we have around us, with so much chaotic information that is bombarding us, having really focused stories like this one is an eye opening, and also cinematically quite interesting.

Tiffany Hanssen: I think that you talk about the chaos around us on a day-to-day basis. I'm thinking more about the chaos around the soldiers that you're embedded with and how that type of chaos tends to make our worlds small. In other words, there are all of these things happening around you. Bombs are exploding, people are dying, people are-- It's this tiny strip of land and everything sort of like, [makes sound], comes into this pinpoint of a position. Did you sense that?

Mstyslav Chernov: The main action of the film happens not only within this 2,000 meters, but over one day. It is all contained and very, very condensed. As soon as you step in that forest, as soon as I stepped in that forest, it barely could have been called forest at that point. As soon as the audience will step in with us, nothing else exists. Your focus entirely goes on the survival. Your focus entirely goes to a man that is right next to you, to the drone that is buzzing over your head, to the bomb that hits right outside of the trench that you are hiding. That focus on the survival, on a goal, again, is an eye opening. When you get out and when you get out alive, I think you know much more about life than you knew before.

Tiffany Hanssen: We're talking with director Mstyslav Chernov about his new film, 2000 Meters to Andriivka. I want to follow up about how your experience was in this, as we've painted it, very narrow slice of land, very small period of time, very condensed experience. One, how did you get there? What's the process for that? Then two, just like, had you prepared yourself enough for what that might actually be like?

Mstyslav Chernov: You can't really prepare yourself for war. This is something you know for sure. All you can make sure that you have a medical training and charged batteries and a friend next to you who will think about your safety as much as you think about his safety. That's how you prepare. For us, this story started with meeting the platoon, meeting Feje, our protagonist and his men.

Tiffany Hanssen: You had identified this region?

Mstyslav Chernov: That region was important for me, because, again, it's quite close to my hometown. It's Donbass. It's right next to the Kharkiv region where I'm from. Those are the places when you visit your grandmother in the village, you go. Then those are little forests where you play hide and seek, and you play war with other boys, and then you run in the fields. Those are places of childhood, very, very, very familiar. Stepping in those places, in those forests, and seeing them changed is also part of why I wanted to be there personally.

This film could very well existed just in form of body cam footage from the helmets of the soldiers, but it wouldn't be the same, contrary to me going there and walking the same path that these soldiers went. We met Feje, we met our protagonist. They just came out from one of the battles. It's a battle for 300 meters. The entire film is split into chapters, and each chapter marks how close you are to the village.

They just came out of a 300-meters battle, and they lost a friend. They showed us this footage from their body cam, and they were analyzing. They were analyzing the battle. I saw it and it was shocking. We saw their reaction, how sad they were, but also how determined they were to continue. I saw this strip of forest on the map, and I thought, "Okay, this is it. I have to make sure we will be with them since this day, until they reach their goal, until they reach Andriivka and raise the flag." So it happened.

Tiffany Hanssen: I want to ask you about that body cam footage. What do you think that does-- I know what it did for me watching it, but what do you think it does for or hope it does for the viewers of the film?

Mstyslav Chernov: Surprisingly-- not surprisingly. I think we see now how technologies of war are changing and being developed. There are so many breakthroughs in the technologies. At the same time, there is also the same breakthrough in technologies of cinematography. Now instruments that were not available for filmmakers several years ago to bring the audience into the boots of the soldiers, to just place the audience right next to them. Now these tools are available. Now we can show the battle from seven different vantage points, two body cam in the battlefield, two drones, two cameras in headquarters. Synchronize everything and just immerse audience in that experience. Something that could never have been done before.

Tiffany Hanssen: Did those all exist before you got there?

Mstyslav Chernov: Usually, it is quite common for military to record battles, especially important battles for the battlefield analysis later. That's what they were always doing. When you come in as a filmmaker, you always try to add some cameras there, of course. That's what happened. Since we came in, we've been recording and filming, but at the same time, we asked to show us the archives of the battle that happened right before we came because it was already on the way. We spent almost a year watching through, translating, and-

Tiffany Hanssen: That's got to be a mountain of films.

Mstyslav Chernov: -editing. About 100 hours of body cam footage. It doesn't seem impossible, but it is such an intense and strong experience that [crosstalk].

Tiffany Hanssen: They don't have them running all the time, right? It's like they flip them on. Is it like police officers?

Mstyslav Chernov: Every battle is recorded on two cameras at least plus drones. Of course, some of the cameras are 360, so you can see everywhere. You can turn your head inside the battle and reframe the shot. That existed before.

Tiffany Hanssen: You mentioned we do see their reaction to seeing some body cam footage. How are they generally when it comes to viewing and/or wearing-- viewing the footage and also wearing the cameras? Are the soldiers fairly receptive to that?

Mstyslav Chernov: It's just a new reality of war. I think this is just what is normal now. Now you can see the battlefield live from so many perspectives, from several drones, from the cameras, from the robotic systems that are deployed on the ground, which wasn't the case in 2023, but now it is. There is a danger in that. When you're translating all that into film, there is a danger that the audience that saw that footage somewhere in YouTube or Instagram or Telegram, they might feel detached, almost like watching a video game.

For us, when we were editing, for me and Michelle Mizner, amazing editor and producer of this film, for us, it was important to make sure that it doesn't feel like a game, that it's all very personal, and the audience will never disengage or detach with humanity of that experience. We stop the scenes that are showed from the body cams and we switch to my camera where I just talk to soldiers about very, very simple things. Those are the most humane and the most warm and important moments of the film.

Tiffany Hanssen: You mentioned there's 100, let's say. Just talk us through the process of that. Is that just you sitting down watching, watching, watching, watching? Taking a break for your mental health. Watching, watching, watching.

Mstyslav Chernov: Translators work. That's the first thing. Of course, I watched the entirety of it, and Michelle is also going through it. She's probably the one who is hit the hardest because she is thoroughly going through each minute of it, and already starting, building the scenes, starting-- seeing the patterns. She was also pregnant at the time. As we were making the film, as we were getting the news that some of our protagonists were dying, and as we were going through all this footage, she was also going through her very important moment in her life.

Tiffany Hanssen: A happy moment.

Mstyslav Chernov: Yes. It was such a condensed and heavy, but at the same time, important moment in our lives. We were following up in an important milestone in our careers and in our work at 20 Days to Mariupol, which at that time, received the Academy Awards. It was work of a lifetime.

Tiffany Hanssen: What surprised you about what you saw?

Mstyslav Chernov: Oh, it always surprises me how optimistic and how strong these men are. In the most impossible situations, in the most dangerous moments, they still managed to smile, to care, to think about their families, to not to give up. I think that gave me strength. As hard as the experience was, as challenging and near-death experience that was, I never regret doing that because I was never alone in this. There is sense of community and there is sense of optimism, especially now. It's so important when it feels like everyone is about to give up on Ukraine, everyone is about to-- or use it for their own political benefits. Knowing that those men are there and my hometown is still not occupied because they're still there--

Tiffany Hanssen: Kharkiv.

Mstyslav Chernov: Yes. They are in Kharkiv region right now, is invaluable. That's the discovery.

Tiffany Hanssen: Journalists are in peril in this country as well. Talk to us about that.

Mstyslav Chernov: In the last 10 years, as I've been through six, seven different wars already, Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan, Gaza, Karabakh, Ukraine. I've seen that journalists have been increasingly considered as targets. The reason for that is that information became a weapon. Even for countries that are considered leading democratic powers in the world, they consider information as a weapon.

Therefore, journalists are becoming targets. For me, it's always very important to talk about it, to make sure that both cinematographers and journalists are never considered to be participants in war-- in information war, or in war in general. Our work is to inform, give context, ask questions. Journalists, filmmakers should not be under any circumstances considered as targets.

Tiffany Hanssen: The danger is-- I should add, actually, before I ask this question, that we are speaking with director Mstyslav Chernov, who won the Academy Award for his film 20 Days to Mariupol. We're talking about his new film, which is 2000 Meters to Andriivka. The danger that journalists face is such that you're not even wearing the press vest that identifies you as a journalist when you go out there, which as a journalist myself, I would think that would be the first thing I would want to do is identify myself as somebody who's not a target, but you are a target.

Mstyslav Chernov: On the front line, yes, because-- You will see that in the film. Carrying the flag is sometimes more-- and trying to take a picture or film, it sometimes is more dangerous than a fight through the forest. Because ultimately, everybody knows that the picture is also a symbol, and it stays there, and stays in the media space. It becomes part of the fight. It doesn't mean I am part of the fight, but the picture itself is part of the fight. It's not enough just to liberate the village or a city. To make it true, to prove it that it really happened, to give hope to people, you also need to take a picture of that, or it didn't happen.

That's what is about history. History is not what happened. History is what we remember. Our job is to make sure that what's remembered is true. That's why it's so dangerous for journalism and for public media to be attacked and the trust in public media and journalism to be undermined. With all the false information, with all generated AI information that is overflowing the internet and the media space, there's less and less space for body of truth. We have to make sure that it survives in time.

Tiffany Hanssen: You mentioned the hopefulness of these soldiers on the field. Are you, as a journalist, hopeful for our profession?

Mstyslav Chernov: Yes. We've seen worse times, and I am hopeful for the profession. I think we just have to adapt. This is one of the reasons why I took on the longer form. I feel that documentary cinema is, at this point at least for me and for the themes that I'm working with, is more impactful than shorter-form journalism. It is reaching the emotions of people, not just giving them information. We know that also truth and information is being attacked and contested, but emotions are always emotions.

If we can get to people's hearts, then they will be also interested in truth and facts. That's what I'm doing. We just have to work together. None of us alone can make a difference in this, but together, collectively, we still can make a difference. As I said before, this body of truth, it will survive, but only if we work together in it.

Tiffany Hanssen: The soldiers are hopeful, but they're also angry. I want to get back to the film now. I have a quote here. They're cursing at Russian soldiers and saying, "Why are you even here?" It seems like there's a good amount of pride and hope, and all of the sort of what we might categorize as positive things that are fueling this internal fire that they have to keep stoking in order to continue across this chasm that, however short it may be, is very, very wide. Half-a-meter, whatever, is long when there's somebody who's holding a gun to you. My point being is that there's also an anger that has to fuel them. You see that complexity in the film. I just wondered if you could comment on how that that pops out here and there.

Mstyslav Chernov: When this soldier asks the question from a Russian soldier who was captured in Andriivka after he was taken, the soldier says, "I don't know." The Ukrainian soldier asks, "Why are you here?" Genuine question. Then the Russian soldier replies, "I don't know why we're here." I think that's one of the key moments of the film. You see the motivation, what led us there to that moment in Andriivka is conversations with all of the soldiers and them being volunteers, them being just from around there. One of the soldiers who I speak with, he is from a rival university of mine, and his hometown is very near to Andriivka.

For him, this is not-- The source of that anger that you're seeing is the fact that someone came to your house and burned it, and killed your friends, and killed part of your family, and you took a gun and you're protecting your home. For them, it's not fight for abstract land that they have to liberate, and those meters and kilometers that we see or miles. For them, its very, very simple, self defense of their home. This is it. They need a gun to do it effectively. When they can't do it, they get angry, because it's hard, because they're fighting against much bigger enemy, and because sometimes it seems that everyone around, all your neighbors, just sit and watch and occasionally offer you to buy a weapon from them.

Tiffany Hanssen: You can't get around the violence of this story, obviously. Do you think it makes sense in the context of the film? In other words, for you, not do you think, how do you think it makes context in the sense of the film?

Mstyslav Chernov: The conversation about the violence in cinema, in films is a very interesting conversation that deserves another program on itself. I'd love to talk about it more, but specifically here, I think our dedication to show the war as realistically as possible, to give honor to experience into the pain of these soldiers that are going through horrible experience of war. There's nothing worse on earth than war, and they have to go through it.

Tuning down the violence means tuning down their pain, and their experiences, and their sacrifices. That's something I wouldn't do. Also, it wouldn't be fair if I wasn't there, too, if I wasn't experiencing that firsthand. Of course, it has to be a very, very, very delicate balance between not overwhelming the audience with the violence, and at the same time, not presenting the war in a way that would seem acceptable.

Tiffany Hanssen: I have a thought. You're right. It's a whole other show, because I have a thousand questions that I could follow up that one with.

Mstyslav Chernov: Let's do it someday.

Tiffany Hanssen: Yes, let's do it someday. Let's talk about screening the film before we end our conversation. You have showed it to some of the families of the fallen soldiers who appeared in the film. What was their reaction?

Mstyslav Chernov: We had a screening in Ukraine, in Kyiv, and families of the fallen soldiers came, and our protagonists and soldiers who were recording the battles came. Everyone was there. It was a huge cinema, 700 people. After the film was over, everyone came to the stage, and it was 10 minutes standing ovation of hundreds of people who were thanking the soldiers and thanking the families for their sacrifices, for their fights. We were all crying. We were hugging, and we were talking.

The wife of Sheva, who is one of the soldiers who lost his life, and who we spent quite a while in trench together, talking. She saw it for the first time, and all of them saw it for the first time. Then she told us, "Finally, his grandson will see who his grandfather was." This was the last moments recorded of him ever. We felt that even if we failed on all difference, even if we don't make a difference anywhere across the world, these families will still have their loved ones and the memory of them living in history.

Then soldiers walked out of the cinema. Then it was also a multiplex cinema. There was a lot of other audiences that came out of Formula 1, How to Train Your Dragon, Lilo & Stitch, because these films are also screening in Ukraine. The soldiers were like, "We really want these people who just going about their lives, we want them to come in the cinema and see what we saw and live through what we lived." That's what I'm also trying to do here in New York.

Tiffany Hanssen: Tell us about seeing the film here in New York.

Mstyslav Chernov: We are opening today in Film Forum. That's an important moment, because for the wider American audiences, this is the first time since Sundance, which we had in screen film in January. That was even before the elections. I am in anticipation of seeing the reaction of people. Did it change? What do they feel about it now since the political climate has shifted? I am both terrified, but also anticipating the conversation with the public.

Tiffany Hanssen: Film Forum tonight, you can see 2000 meters to Andriivka. The director is Mstyslav Chernov. We've been in conversation with him today. Thank you so much.

Mstyslav Chernov: Thank you. Stay safe.